Gretchen Eischen (Icertis) - A Marketer's Dream

Vin: Welcome to The Marketing Stir Podcast by Stirista. Probably the most entertaining marketing podcast you're going to put in your ear. My name is Vin, the Associate Producer here at Stirista. The goal of this podcast is to chat with industry leaders and get their take on the current challenges of the market, and we'll also have a little fun along the way. In this episode Vincent and Ajay chat with Gretchen Eischen, Chief Marketing Officer at Icertis. They discuss strategy, structure as well as technology that helps business use data. Ajay is delighted to continue season two, and Vincent gets some new digs. Give it a listen.

Vincent Pietrafesa: All right, ladies and gentlemen, it's me, Vincent Pietrafesa the Vice President of B2B products here at Stirista. That mean be one thing, and one thing only, it's another episode of Stirista's The Marketing Stir, part of season two. We made it to season two, how cool are we? We could have just kept it going, but it's cooler to say that we're in seasons. Thank you for joining us now as we are multiple episodes into season two. It is great to be back here with you. Such positive feedback from everyone who's been enjoying these episodes. We love hearing it. Ajay and I have been at some in- person events recently and it was overwhelming to hear the people who were listening to these episodes. It's pretty cool. I feel special. Thank you for making me feel special out there, ladies and gentlemen. First, before we begin, Stirista, who are these guys again, if you don't know? Stirista, we are a marketing technology company. We specialize in identity. We have our own business to business data, our own business to consumer data. We help people target that data, to help them get new customers. Who doesn't want new customers? My area, we specialize in B2B, we help people with their marketing needs based on personas, account- based marketing, we own our own DSP. Email me vincent @ stirista. com. That is how confident I am that we can help. I just gave you my email address. The other thing I'm confident about is my co- host. I got spoiled because I got to see him for a couple of weeks here in New York City and a little bit in San Antonio, but I have not seen him in a while. Ladies and gentlemen, my commander- in- chief here at Stirista, Mr. Ajay Gupta. What's going on, Ajay?

Ajay Gupta: Hey, Vincent. Good to be back on air here. It feels like it's been a little while, but glad that our little podcast has now made it to a second season and we have quite the guests lined up for this season.

Vincent Pietrafesa: Absolutely. I am so excited about our next guest. We will get to her in just one moment. I already had spoken to her. I'm really excited for you to meet her and for her to talk about the new venture that she is now part of at Icertis, that's a little tease right there but we'll get to that in one moment. But yes, Ajay, it's great we're on season two of the podcast, a few episodes in and I feel it, I love that in- person is coming back a little bit. It paused there. It's coming back. I hope it's coming back. We have a few events coming up with Marketing EDGE. I, of course, I'm also hosting the Silver Apple Awards, November 4th. I just got some new garb. Is it garb? Digs, as they call it, some new clothing. Let me give a shout out, we haven't taken on any advertising here at Stirista, although people ask us all the time. I'm going to give a shout out to my... I know you're a big fan of this stuff too. I have a custom guy. Of course, I have a guy. When you're Italian, you have guys. I got a meat guy, I've got a... For me, I just have an awkward body shape, I always had. My shoulders are enormous, and then I have this teeny tiny little waist. I'm kidding, that's not true about my waist. I'm shaped like a rectangle. As you know, I often have to get custom gear. A little shout out. I went to see my guy at Custom Men, custommen. com, my pal, Vijay. You know why I went to go see him? I received a text message that there was a Christmas in summer sale, and that piqued my interest and I went to go see him. Marketing works, ladies and gentlemen. So, go visit. If you are in the New York City area, my pal Vijay at Custom Men, but I know Ajay, as a custom guy himself. All those flashy jackets that you wear, they look great on you. But that's it. I was like, I'm going to give him a shout out. He did such a great job. It's not easy to deal with me or to measure me, I guess. But hey, I'm happy. Shout out there.

Ajay Gupta: Did he ask you to talk less if you-

Vincent Pietrafesa: Usually, he just said, " Hey man, I'm just here to measure you. Why are you telling me your life story?" I get it. But no, he's my guy there, Vijay. Also, he does a lot of the New York Giants, so I feel special. All those big offensive linemen who don't have my same problem, they even have... It's harder to fit them. But anyway, enough about that, it's so great to be back, and it's so great to have this next guest, Ajay. I am really excited. Please, a warm Marketing Stir welcome for the Chief Marketing Officer of Icertis, Gretchen Eischen. What's going on, Gretchen?

Gretchen Eischen: Hello. Hi, Vincent. Hi, Ajay, thanks so much for having me here on The Marketing Stir. I'm super excited.

Vincent Pietrafesa: We're excited. It's so great to talk to you again. It's so great to see you. Again, those of you who are watching us on video, Gretchen, let's get right into it. We're so happy that you're on The Marketing Stir. For those of our listeners who haven't heard of Icertis, please tell them about Icertis.

Gretchen Eischen: Yes, absolutely. I'm happy to do so. I have recently joined Icertis. You mentioned I'm the Chief Marketing Officer there, joining about three months ago, and Icertis is really the contract intelligence platform of the world. Really, when you think about what that actually means, traditionally, if you think about contracts, you think about paper- based documents, you think about problems of having to do negotiations, they're kind of a problem in most organizations, they're a nuisance. They cause delays, they can be hard to find after you've signed them. A lot of folks that are really looking to approach this problem approach it really traditionally. They look at creating contract lifecycle management workflows, and automation and a repository and some kind of basic search capabilities to help to really address the problems that contracts cause. But here at Icertis, we're actually really looking at contracts for what they really are. They're the representation of a handshake, the agreement that forms the foundation of a business relationship. It's the single source of truth for what a company buys, what they sell, and how companies run. We created technology that can digitalize these contracts and these contract processes to take all of that unstructured data that exists in an SOW, or an MSA and really give it structure, allow organizations to visualize what's included in all of those contracts, analyze the information that rests within them, and then help to really make sure that by integrating in with other systems like ERP or CRM, people who are leveraging our technology can really realize the intent of what was agreed upon. It's so much more than contract lifecycle management. We're leveraging AI and ML to really help companies to make better business decisions using this data.

Vincent Pietrafesa: I like that. You're the first type of company like this in the contract lifecycle management on the podcast. So, welcome. I love that concept. Gretchen, two questions to follow that, more on the role of Chief Marketing Officer within Icertis. Walk me through some of the duties and responsibilities and then a question we love asking all of our guests, how you got into marketing. Talk to us about that path.

Gretchen Eischen: Yeah, I'd love to. Awesome. Listen, my day- to- day as Chief Marketing Officer at Icertis is really about providing strong leadership to a team of about 42 marketers, who are really covering all stages of the customer journey. From awareness, demand generation, helping to launch new products. We have a really strong partner marketing function that exists within Icertis, as we are partners with huge organizations like Microsoft and Salesforce and SAP. Then we also have, of course, a customer marketing function that exists within our team as well, since we are a B2B and SAS organization. My role is really, helping to set the structure of our strategy and prepare our team for really strong execution so that we can help to drive the incredible growth that Icertis is building on right now. Let's see, I think sharing a little bit with you about my role and how I got into marketing, I actually, I mentioned that I've only been with Icertis for a short amount of time, just about three months now. Prior to that, I had actually been with Ariba and consequently, SAP Ariba as they got acquired by SAP several years ago. I've been there for about 16 years. Safe to say, I'm a loyalist. I actually had an awesome experience at Ariba. Ariba does procurement technology, and I spent many years there helping to serve our clients who were using some of our sourcing and contract technologies at Ariba, and really spent a lot of time in customer facing roles. Whether that was acting as a project manager, delivering software solutions for our clients, helping our clients to adopt our solutions, working with suppliers in the Ariba network, who were really wanting to build and grow their business through eCommerce and needed some consultative support in order to do so. I really spent a large portion of my career, working directly with customers and understanding their needs, understanding why it is so painful to go through a digital transformation, and what's needed in that journey. I'm so fortunate to have had the chance to have many different careers within one company at Ariba and SAP, the ending of which for the last six years was indeed in marketing. The reason that I ended up in marketing really had to do with again, the fact that I had, had so many different experiences within the company. I knew our organization well, I knew our customer sentiment well. After we had been acquired by SAP, and we got a new Chief Marketing Officer, Alicia Tillman, who consequently then went on to become the CMO for SAP proper. But when she came into the Ariba organization, she needed someone to help her navigate, she needed someone who could help her understand the executive relationships and how our organization worked together. I had the incredible fortune to be tapped on the shoulder to apply for a role running marketing strategic projects. Honestly, it was like coming home to me, when I joined the marketing organization. I just was fascinated to have this opportunity to learn directly from an extremely strong female leader, who helped me understand all of the various functions of marketing while practicing. I had the chance, really, to run her marketing strategy. She tasked me with building out an operations function. I got to go extremely deep in marketing operations, strategy. We built a demand center function for her. Then because I also was her chief of staff, I also got to work with all of the different marketing leaders that went across her team, and really learn more about not only what they did, but how they needed to work together to bring the strategy to life. I did that for probably three years. Incredible learning in that experience, which I loved. Then I had the chance to actually shift gears a little bit and run some specific marketing functions. I stepped in to actually be the corporate marketing leader for Ariba, running our brand and awareness, our AR functions and corporate communications, also running our campaigns and our digital marketing team. Then, after I did that for about a year, we actually combined forces with Fieldglass, which does contingent labor and workforce management. Ariba and Fieldglass team together and I had the incredible honor of actually stepping into the leadership position to run the full strategy and execution for both of those brands. I did that for just over a year and a half or so, within the SAP environment and just loved it. Had a terrific experience and knew I was ready to take the leap into being a Chief Marketing Officer for an external organization as well.

Ajay Gupta: Gretchen, that's great. Every story we hear is unique and yours is no exception. Definitely, we can see why you are in marketing and definitely from your answers we can see it all makes sense.

Gretchen Eischen: Thanks, Ajay.

Ajay Gupta: Gretchen, let's talk a little bit about the marketing stack and I know you're new at this company, but even at SAP, are there particular software, or technologies that you highly recommend, and that you leverage?

Gretchen Eischen: Yeah, great question. It's interesting, actually. My experience within SAP, we did have the opportunity to actually become one of the first parts of the marketing organization in SAP to leverage Marketo. As we built out our demand center function within Ariba, especially because, we were one of the cloud acquisitions that SAP had made early on, we really needed to make sure that we could leverage technology that would allow us to interact with multiple audiences. Because of the partitioning that Marketo offered, we could create not only really strong prospect marketing, dry really strong relationships and adoption with our current customer base, and also market and support adoption for the 15 million sellers that are part of the Ariba network. We did have the opportunity to leverage Marketo, integrate it into the SAP CRM system that we were leveraging, as well as a number of other systems that we were working with. We also leveraged Outreach as part of our tech stack. That is something that we are leveraging today at Icertis as well, although we're leveraging Pardot and Salesforce. So, it is a much different technology stack environment. The single thread that I would see between there was our use of Outreach, heavily leveraged right now by our insight sales team, to engage with prospects. I think, to me, one of the lessons that I learned early on from my marketing operations, the vice president that was reporting to me for marketing operations, he really taught me... He's literally a professor of marketing operations. He teaches at Auburn, great guy, by the way. Shout out to my friend, Stewart. We actually, because of the work that we did together to build out this demand center and set up the marketing operations function at Ariba, we had the chance to actually present together the strategy that we have deployed at SiriusDecisions at their annual conference a few years ago, in 2017, which was awesome. Stewart taught me so much about marketing strategy and operations. Every Friday, in our time together, we would get together for, like, two and a half hours, and he would literally give me an educational seminar on all things marketing operations. One of the lessons that I still retain very much from that is, it doesn't matter what technology stack that you're using, truly. What matters is the process, the strategy, and how you're creating the right system of engagement to execute. To me, I think is we are, in the process right now of really, with a new leader, anytime a new leader comes in, you're going to probably do some level of marketing tech stack evaluation. We're no exception. We're in the weeds at looking at what we have today, how it works together, where do we have gaps? We're leveraging demand base heavily today, but also looking at other ways to really gauge intent. Also, certainly as we make some continued updates and upgrades to our website, particularly, are looking at different ways that we can also engage in a deeper level of personalization across our website as well.

Ajay Gupta: That makes a lot of sense, Gretchen. We go through the same thing, and I think what you said earlier, it makes a lot more sense to improve processes, because otherwise every time there is a change in the company, people are very attached to certain software.

Gretchen Eischen: That's right, indeed.

Ajay Gupta: Gretchen, how important is demand generation for you, and what are some of the channels you're using right now to generate leads?

Gretchen Eischen: Yeah, absolutely. Demand generation is of critical importance for us as we grow. We're growing about 60% year on year for the first half of the year, which is incredible. But I think our unique opportunity is that, I think a lot of larger organizations like enterprise level organizations have either created in- house tools and technology to manage the repository work of a contract lifecycle management application. Helping to really embolden those responsible to understand that contract intelligence is so much broader than just simple repository and process workflow. Contract intelligence really is the opportunity for people in procurement or people who work in sales and lead sales organizations, people who work in finance, or of course, the legal teams who are all responsible for driving contracts, they have an opportunity to really drive strategic business impact, leveraging the intelligence that exists in their contracts. We have an opportunity to really shift the message in the way that we're actually helping to drive not only awareness of contract intelligence as a tool, but really of contract intelligence as a category. That presents an awesome opportunity for us to absolutely engage with, even those organizations who believe they're doing contract lifecycle management today, they're really only touching the tip of the iceberg as it relates to what we can deliver. I think, having physical events is typically a lot of where we would be driving demand for enterprise level organizations in the past. We've clearly had to shift our channel strategy, and our mix, much more to digital in the course of the past year and a half. I think, leveraging, not only, traditional digital marketing channels with paid search and paid media and paid social, I actually really admire what the team here has built out as it relates to content syndication. We have just some incredible content that has been created, especially during the COVID days, really looking at how contracts and the intelligence residing in contracts can make a difference in a time of global supply chain disruption, or a time of just incredible social change and social movement, as well. Having the opportunity to actually understand what exists in the clauses that reside in your contracts and how to understand the commitments that you've made, or how they can be changed, you need to have some intelligence that can allow you to do that. We're able to dig into that, create a ton of different content that was really thought leadership level content. Our team has really dug into how do we make sure that, that content can be available in lots of different channels? Whether it's in webinars, whether it's in shorter form social, whether it's in blogs. We actually have a really active blog strategy as well, which I really admire. We are continuing as well to get prepared to go back to physical, in- person events. We will start that in September, and are very eager to keep moving, to be in- person with, as safely as possible, our customers and prospects at events where social distancing, masking and vaccinations are required. We're really looking to make sure that we can be out in- person with our prospects as quickly as we can be, as safely as we can be. Then, we follow up some of those in- person engagements or some of our core webinars, with more opportunities for networking, and really just getting companies together in groups and allowing them, through a platform that we are providing. We do a series of taste talks where we have a direct mail wine or tequila tasting, for example, that would be delivered to someone in their home. Then we bring these groups of prospects back together, but it's not a big sales pitch, it's really about creating the networking experience that so many people are missing in their lack of physical events today. That's something that we're really engaged in. I think the other thing I would say is also, just from a channels perspective, something that's really important to us is really leaning in on the relationships that we have with our partners. I mentioned SAP, Microsoft is also a huge partner of ours, Salesforce. We have a number of really large partnerships that we're heavily invested in. We also leverage those partnerships to really just do some more robust targeting, and really look at where we have a really strong industry or vertical alignment, for example, that we can lean into with given partners, or leaning in with different technology partners as well where we're highlighting our sell side use case, for example, with Salesforce, and how we integrate into CRM so that contract intelligence can be within the context of the systems that our audiences are using, is also something that's really important to us. We also try to make sure that we are participating in sponsoring some of these larger events, as well so that we can make sure that our strong partnership is really represented in the events that our partners are driving as well.

Vincent Pietrafesa: I love hearing that, Gretchen. Some great ideas there. It's that follow up with the prospects. I love the thought leadership piece as well, because that's something that instead of here's just a bunch of, hey, try this, try this demo, demo, demo. It's some thought leadership pieces, it's a webinar. We think that the fact that we started this podcast back in March, really just as an outlet, just to have companies and different sides of the story and industries represented. It was just that, thought leadership, just bringing that to the forefront. I think that's why we have so many great listeners because of that. I want to, because we have so many great listeners and great companies out there listening to the podcast, you touched upon different channels and different enterprise level, different potential verticals. But let's hone in on that, let's talk about, Gretchen, the ideal client, ideal verticals are for people to utilize Icertis?

Gretchen Eischen: It's a little bit of a marketer's dream, to be honest with you. I think one of the things that really attracted me about Icertis and their value proposition and also just frankly, the fun of being a marketer is that, we actually have solutions that are tailor made for people in the procurement industry. For organizations that are looking to better manage their spend, and have a tighter control on cost savings, or to align with companies that are mirroring their values from a sustainability or supplier diversity perspective, we have an opportunity to really support procurement organizations in managing their buy side contracts, and again, really seeing through the intention of those agreements, very strongly. We also work with audiences on the sell side. A CRO would be an ideal client for us as well, because if you think about the nuisance of a contract, if I'm a salesperson, and I get agreement, I get a handshake and a head nod from a client, and now it's just getting through the contracting process that stands between me and my quota, I need that contracting process to happen as quickly as humanly possible. In fact, humanly possible is the problem. By automating, and actually accelerating the negotiation process between sellers and their clients, we can help a salesperson to make sure that they're making their quota and getting the inaudible I think it's really fantastic for us to have both the buy and the sell side. We also then have very broad compliance, risk management value proposition that we can deliver to legal organizations that have just other standard corporate and legal contracts that they are managing. Maybe it's real estate, maybe it's mergers and acquisitions, maybe it's partnership agreements that the legal teams are driving, we can deliver just, fantastic intelligence in terms of, what has been agreed on for force majeure with X client base as an example, to help those entities really manage risk better. For me, it's really appealing, because we can actually dig in with a use case, no matter where the pain begins in an organization. But then we have an opportunity to really help expand the use of our solution across multiple departments within one enterprise. To me, I think that's just a really exciting opportunity to get to really understand multiple customer needs within one organization and help them to really maximize the value of a solution that maybe one department has licensed across the entire enterprise. We support, really, any vertical or any industry. But we are beginning to really hone in right now on a number of different industries like CPG, and pharma healthcare, where we can actually make sure that not only are we delivering the department level value, but by understanding better, the way that a buyer in retail, for example, is leveraging contracts, we can actually really accelerate time to value because we can make sure that all of the process workflows that have to exist, the very specific way in which CPG is managing distribution, for example, we can create the workflows that will really help to accelerate the process. We can just embed that directly in to help clients to really, again, using our solution very quickly. We are really working right now on leaning in on a number of different vertical and industry solutions, that we're really excited about bringing to market.

Vincent Pietrafesa: Because a lot of the things you hear, as a company, you might have heard, okay, I have a way of scanning a document and just sending it, but really not the entire lifecycle of it. I think a lot of companies over the last year or so had to really pivot and look deeply into how they're managing this because, I remember myself with, I could just, scan an SWO, because, people were at the office, and they'll just get it at the office, and I could print one out. People don't have access to all that now. I think people are really looking at digital transformation. They're looking at contract lifecycle management. But also what you've said there, Gretchen, is you really getting to know the entire organization, what the actual customers are doing. How important is that to really understand and build those relationships with those customers, understand their workflow, how other departments communicate with each other? I'd love for you to touch upon that.

Gretchen Eischen: It's 100% critical for us to really understand the needs, the pain points, the challenges that our customers face. Also, to do two things. Number one, I think it's critical for us to be able to deliver products and solutions that meet their needs today, but it's also critical for us to be thinking ahead and innovating for the future. If you think about what you just described in terms, you alluded to some of the challenges, of course, that COVID and the pandemic created for organizations in digital transformation. In the last year, I think we saw the entire trajectory of digital transformation come to life for so many organizations. For many, if you weren't digital, or you couldn't become digital, you were dead. To me, really looking at, how do we understand what our customers... How do we anticipate the challenges that our customers may face when disruption or mergers and acquisitions or economic downturn, or incredible growth happens for organizations? How can we create solutions that will help them no matter the outcome, no matter the journey that they end up on? We can't do that, of course, unless we are creating super strong relationships with our clients. We're really lucky to have large scale organizations that are partnering with us to help us to learn. Whether it's Volkswagen or Accenture, or Daimler, or J& J, or Best Buy, we have really tremendous organizations who are in different industries, and facing different challenges, and facing different impacts from supply chain disruption very differently, which gives us I think, a beautiful scope of experience to lend on and to lean into, as we do think about the innovations for the future. When we think about how we can really understand... If I can really, truly understand a client that we have that sits in the automotive industry, for example, or in manufacturing, and what their needs are, and I can make it quicker for them to actually adopt a solution that will help them create their contract more quickly or understand what's in their tens of 1000s of documents that exist for them globally, when I need to know exactly what our force majeure obligations and commitments are, that's really powerful. To me, I think that, really getting in deep and understanding how our solutions could be used, not only in the day- to- day, but in those emergency situations is something that I think is super critical for us in our innovation strategy.

Ajay Gupta: Gretchen, next is one of our signature questions. I'm sure with your job title, you get a lot of LinkedIn messages from a lot of people. What's a message that gets your attention and one that really annoys you?

Gretchen Eischen: Great question. I will say that my husband and I were just talking about this over the weekend, I am really annoyed at present by the meme like social posts, even on LinkedIn. I don't want to see another post that begins with, I don't know who needs to hear this, but... No one needs to hear it inaudible no one needs to hear it.

Vincent Pietrafesa: If you started out like that, no one needs to hear it, yeah.

Gretchen Eischen: Exactly, indeed. Too generic. I think that's honestly the thing that annoys me the most is anything that is just too generic. It's interesting, and I'm sure this will resonate with the two of you very strongly, given your experience, but to me, I need to see personalization that's beyond the generic. Having somebody send me a note about where I went to college, I'm so far removed from college, it means nothing to me at this point. Having somebody that is understanding... It's so much more important to me to have someone that is tailoring a message to me based on the job that I do and the role that I play in an organization and maybe anticipating where I am in my journey with that organization. That is so much more relevant than just scrubbing LinkedIn and pulling a random fact from social media about me. I love it when people are framing, again, that they know me in context of who I actually am today, not something that's listed on my resume from more than 16 years ago.

Ajay Gupta: Gretchen, we're coming to the end of this. We also like to get to know people in a more personal level. Can you tell us a little bit about what you like to do in your free time?

Gretchen Eischen: Sure. Absolutely. I really treasure my free time so much and my husband and I love to spend time together. We're still ridiculously crazy about each other, which is nice. He's from England and we met in France about 22 years ago. We're just celebrating our anniversary this weekend. So, sorry if I'm going a little bit too romantic, but we love to spend time together and we love to watch murder mysteries. We love inaudible have watched anything that we can find that's Agatha Christie related, we watch all the time. We love it so much in fact that we have named our dog, Agatha. We love to take her out for long walks, we love to travel, we love to live the good life, drink wine. We love to eat, so, as a result I love to cook and we love to make meals together and travel whenever we can.

Ajay Gupta: That's awesome. I think I have read almost every single Agatha Christie book.

Gretchen Eischen: Perfect. Excellent. Have you watched any? There's some amazing content, some new things-

Ajay Gupta: I have watched some of the older stuff. I haven't watched any of the newer stuff. So, I'll have to connect with you offline and get some recommendations.

Gretchen Eischen: I hate to tell you, Ajay, it makes me jealous, because I've seen it all at this point. Anytime that we find something that's new, we get so excited by it. Knowing that it's new to you, I'm really jealous. Enjoy.

Vincent Pietrafesa: Gretchen I see you attended the University... No, I'm kidding.

Ajay Gupta: That was good.

Vincent Pietrafesa: Thank you. Sometimes I have a good one. Gretchen, just last question for me just as the next months, we get to the end of the year here, some new things you're excited about at Icertis?

Gretchen Eischen: Oh, man, I am super excited that later this year, we are going to be bringing, as I mentioned a little bit, and alluded to, some new vertical solutions to market. I'm really excited for us to have the opportunity to start serving up some awesome content and thought leadership about how our use cases can be applied to these different verticals. I'm also really excited that we're a really growing team. As a leader, nothing is more powerful and fun to me than getting the chance to actually build this team out. I'm really looking forward to growing the team. Later this year, we're going to be adding goals, and corporate marketing and demand generation and marketing operations, and partner marketing and customer marketing and product, really all of the functions that we lead, throughout the rest of this year, just in anticipation of growth. One of the things that I really love about this organization is that our leadership, it's really fun to work with founders who are so passionate about what they deliver, and who are also really eager for us to try new things. Testing out some new strategies as well, and social particularly is something that I'm really looking forward to, throughout the end of this year. Also, we'll be doing some different formats of demos and different formats of webinars throughout the rest of this year as well, which I'm looking forward to digging into with my team and just testing some new things out, seeing what works.

Vincent Pietrafesa: That's amazing, Gretchen. It has been an absolute pleasure talking to you on The Marketing Stir. Ladies and gentlemen, that is the Chief Marketing Officer of Icertis, Gretchen Eischen. I'm Vincent Pietrafesa, that's Ajay Gupta. This has been another episode of The Marketing Stir. Thank you so much for listening. We'll talk to you soon. Thanks for listening to The Marketing Stir Podcast by Stirista. Please like, rate and subscribe. If you're interested in being a guest on the podcast, email us at themarketingstir @ stirista. com. Thanks for listening.