Nirosha Methananda (Influ2) - Utopia for Marketers

Speaker 1: Big data has gotten too big. Whether you're a B2B marketer or a consumer brand, your data needs to be viable, relevant, and accessible, so that Stirista can help you retain customers, acquire customers, and make it personal.

Vincent Pietrafesa: Welcome to the Marketing Stir Podcast by Stirista, probably the most entertaining marketing podcast you're going to put in your ear. I'm Vin, the associate producer here at Stirista. The goal of this podcast is to chat with industry leaders and get their takes on the current challenges of the market and, well, have a little fun along the way. In today's episode, Ajay and Vincent chat with Nirosha Methananda, VP of Marketing at Influ2. She talks about how, over time, attention spans have shortened and how mediums such as video have allowed marketers to connect digitally. Ajay enjoys a full day of tennis and Vincent is glad that Ajay finally doesn't cancel a visit with them. Give it a listen. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to another episode of Stirista's The Marketing Stir. I am your host, Vincent Pietrafesa, the vice president of B2B products and partnerships here at Stirista, and still interim general manager. They have not stripped that title. By they, I mean my co- host and CEO, Ajay Gupta. We'll get to him in a minute. I know you're anxious to hear from him and his recent adventures with me, partially with me. But we'll get to those in a minute. Let's pause just to talk about Stirista for 10 seconds. That's all we talk about Stirista. We are a marketing technology company. We own our own business- to- business data, business- to- consumer data. We help customers utilize that data to help them get new customers. Aren't new customers great? Also, we have our own sending platform, email. We have our own DSP called AdStir. We do connect to TV, OTT display. Email me, vincent @ stirista.com. That is dangerous, giving my email address to all our amazing listeners. It's not. I love the emails that I received, telling us how much you love the show, telling us what you think we can do differently. It's short. That happens, too. But we love it. And thank you for emailing me about our services. We really do appreciate that. The other thing I appreciate, I got to see him. I felt like he's redeemed himself from prior episodes, ladies and gentlemen, where he canceled on me to go to the show in Boston, the B2B Sales& Marketing Exchange, where I was supposed to meet our amazing guest. But we'll get to her in a moment. Ajay Gupta, the CEO and co- host. What's going on, AJ?

Ajay Gupta: Hello, Vincent. It was good seeing you as well. I had a pretty good trip to New York. Got to see us open for the first time, which was, for tennis fans, it's one of the best things you can do.

Vincent Pietrafesa: Yeah, it was great. We had San Francisco together where we had a nice intimate event with people from Stirista and some of our clients out there, some podcast guests who are on... some just companies who are looking to learn about us. I think those intimate events are coming back. Those are a thing we did went to New York. But we got to see you there. And yes, in New York City, you got to see the US Open, which is exciting. Serena Williams going out, retiring, still on top. Even though she knew when her match, she is a powerhouse. I love, me, some Serena Williams. But what was your experience like? You were a huge tennis fan, Ajay. It's like if I were going to the Super Bowl for football.

Ajay Gupta: I wasn't really sure what to expect. But it looks like you can largely walk around and see almost any match you want. So, that's pretty cool. You're not obligated to sit at one match. You can go. I think we ended up seeing about 10, 11 matches, 30, 40 minutes each. So, it's like a Disneyland for tennis fans, almost. So, you can see all of the players that you like. And it was particularly crazy because it turned out to be the last day of Serena Williams' professional career. So, that was cool.

Vincent Pietrafesa: That's awesome. And you get the autographs. You meet any people. I see those big tennis balls that a lot of the, mostly kids, get the autographs. But you never know, I'd be out there trying to get some signatures.

Ajay Gupta: Yeah, I know. I'll take my son next year as a prop to get the signature. Otherwise, it looks like I'm too much of a fan.

Vincent Pietrafesa: Yeah, I know. It's like, " Can you make that out to Ajay?" It's like, " That's your name." It's like, " You're fine. You're fine." That's awesome. Since I've talked to him, I've taken my son to his first baseball game.

Ajay Gupta: Oh, nice.

Vincent Pietrafesa: inaudible New York Mets six is to zero. We won. He was so excited, as I am excited for this next guest. Ladies and gentlemen, I haven't met her yet in person. I supposed to meet her in person. Another day. Another day, we'll meet. We will meet in person. But I did meet some for colleagues from this amazing company. Ajay, we are in for an amazing treat today. We have Influ2 on.

Ajay Gupta: Influ2?

Vincent Pietrafesa: I don't know if you've ever heard of them. If you haven't heard of them, you're about to hear from the vice president of marketing. Ladies and gentlemen, please, a warm Marketing Stir welcome for Nirosha Methananda. What's going on, Nirosha?

Nirosha Methananda: Enjoying life here in LA. We're having a heatwave at the moment. But, yeah, good. Thank you for having me. I'm excited to be on. I feel like I need to hire you, Vincent, to be able to do our intro, our company intro. I just love that.

Vincent Pietrafesa: Motivational. I try to be a motivational speaker. I'm not. No, I'm kidding. I don't motivate much. But yeah, I love... this is my excitement all the time. Again, I still am on my first cup of coffee here. And well, thank you for that. But no, thank you especially for joining us, Nirosha. We were supposed to meet in Boston at that conference. We'll meet again. I know we will. And I got to meet your CEO. I got to meet some folks from the marketing team, your team there that you sit on. But it was great. And you saw the booth. In fact, you had a booth there. And they were meeting some great people. So, it was nice there. But thank you for joining us on the podcast. Nirosha, for the listeners out there, talk to us about Influ2, what the company does, and your role within the organization.

Nirosha Methananda: Yeah. So, as you said, Influ2 is a fairly nascent brand in the B2B martech, adtech space. It's been around for about five years now. So, at the core of what Influ2 does is it essentially takes your display and social advertising and makes it tangible. So, we spend a lot of money on advertising, as you know. And it's not always tangible around who you're reaching, how they're engaging. And one of the lifelong dreams or utopia for marketers is being able to connect sales in a meaningful way. And that's what Influ2 essentially does with your display and social media advertising. So, that's the core of the product from that perspective. And it's something we call person- based advertising.

Vincent Pietrafesa: I love it. And talk to us a little bit about your day- to- day, what you're overseeing, Nirosha. And then we'd love to understand... this is one of our staple questions... how you got into marketing in the first place. Sometimes, it's... well, it's usually never, " I studied marketing, and here I am." If it is, great, we want to hear about it. But talk to us about some of your duties there, but also how you got into marketing.

Nirosha Methananda: Yeah. So, I've been with Influ2 for about a year and a half now. I came on board with them to build out. So, where Influ2 started, it started with a marketing program using its own product, purely its own product. And then it got to a stage where our CEO, Dmitri Lisitski, who you met, he wanted to build something hard- to- build but easier- to- sell. The thing is, when you sell, you've got something easy to sell. And when it's a no- brainer, you still need brand and trust, and you still need that marketing program around it. And essentially, that's what I came on board to do. So, it's to build out some of our marketing functions around the brands, around comms, around events, product marketing, customer marketing, so on and so forth. So, I sit across the top of our marketing function and have been really building it out. And day- to- day, it's a startup life. So, the other day, I was building out a splash page, or I just ran a workshop this morning. So, every day is different. But that's what I really enjoy about startup life. And the way I got into marketing, you're right, it wasn't a straight journey at all for me. I love this term, intentional serendipity. And I feel like that's what I use to describe my journey. I got to start in a law firm, really looking at events, and from there moved into retail. I was an AE to a CEO... a CMO, excuse me, of a retailer in Australia called Officeworks. So, I really love stationery. And that was one of the qualifiers.

Vincent Pietrafesa: I love stationery. That's the first. We all love it, but no one's ever pronounced it on the podcast.

Nirosha Methananda: It was like a dream come true because I could have whatever stationery I wanted. But also, she was so generous. She was so generous. In the interview, I just said to her... she said, " Why do you want this role?" And I said, " I'd like a foot in the door of marketing." And I worked with her very closely. And we had a massive marketing team that spanned across. We had the agency in- house, brand in- house, PR, digital, so on and so forth. So, I really got to work with all of those departments and specialize. I moved into more of a PR role with them. From there, I moved to a company called Experian Hitwise, which was really where my interest in digital and tech started. They're a competitive intelligence tool. So, again, I was a generalist marketer there, with the team across the board of comms, brand, so on and so forth. And then, from there I went into like a journalism role with another company in Australia. They were called The Media Pad. And they ran big trade shows. And they had a publication. And so, I got into a bit of journalism and a lot of content, which was exciting. And then from there I moved to PwC, with PwC Australia, to start a blog for them, essentially, called Digital Pulse. They were spinning out their digital consulting. And so, I built that out for them. And then I ended up taking over across their marketing holistically across tech consulting. So, that was an interesting journey. And then from there I ended up at Bombora, which is a US- based company, also in New York, which is where I used to be. And they're a leading internet data provider, which is the bomb at the minute marketing technology perspective. So, that's been my journey. Along the way, it's have dabbled in different things. I like to be a generalist. I like to learn and understand. And that's been the fundamental string of what's pulled me.

Vincent Pietrafesa: So, from your marketing journey starting in Australia ending up in New York, what are some of the things that you've seen change over the years?

Nirosha Methananda: I think one of the big things that I've seen is just the diversification of the landscape. And there's so many tools. For whatever you can think of from a marketing perspective, there's a tool for it. I look at Scott Brinker's martech ecosystem, and just looking at that year on year on year, it blows my mind how many different solutions there are, how many different categories are expanding. I think that's one of the biggest differences. Obviously, also with COVID, I don't think our attention spans were brilliant before. With COVID, they really become very short because we're bombarded with a lot of material and things like that. So, I think mediums like video that allow us to connect digitally, particularly using it from a marketing promotion perspective, I think that's something that is engaging and allows you to connect in a way that is beyond copy and content. Although, I still love the written word. But yeah, I think those sorts of trends are things that I'm noticing. The other thing I'm noticing as well post- pandemic is a lot of people I think took stock during this time. And you've got this great resignation. You've got quitting. Now, we're going into this economic downturn. And I think with that comes a combination of a lot of turning, especially in terms of from a B2C perspective, but even from a B2B perspective, of just relevance and mindfulness around time, around what you're investing in, around what you're doing. And I think that translates into marketing from personalization relevance, being able to really reach people in a meaningful way. So, I think those are some of the things that I've noticed from my perspective.

Vincent Pietrafesa: And Nirosha, I want to stay on that topic, the post- pandemic, because you talked about some of the trends there. What else are you excited about, really, post- pandemic when it comes to marketing? Well, I mentioned some of those smaller events. But talk to me in your opinion about that.

Nirosha Methananda: That, for me, is exciting. I love events. I do. I know that it's a little bit of some people are like, " Oh, God, I hate events." But I really love them. And I love them. I should love them for leads. But I actually just love them.

Vincent Pietrafesa: I love them for leads. I love it.

Nirosha Methananda: But I just love them for connecting to people and being able to meet face- to- face, being able to get to know people and one another above and beyond the meeting that you hold. And to be able to have and create those experiences, I'm excited about that. I think I'm excited at the innovation that's come from it, because sometimes you just go along, rest on your laurels a little bit. When something's working, you don't necessarily try and change it. And so, it takes something to shake you up and change the way you look at things, change the way you message things. And I think that's what the pandemic has done. And you're seeing a lot more, I think, innovation in terms of messaging, in terms of engagement, in terms of the events, and so on and so forth. So, while it wasn't a great experience, I could have done it without it, I think those are the some of the silver linings that have come out of it. I'm excited about that.

Vincent Pietrafesa: I agree. I think, as people talk about video conferencing fatigue, I also think that it really helped people. Because think about before, I didn't always do video conferencing. It was like a conference call, one of those conference call numbers that you dialed into and you never saw the person. It's changed that. And I think that's going to be a positive. But yeah, you're right, it's nothing better than that interaction. This event we did in San Francisco, it was a smaller event. But by the end of it, we're taking photos together. Everyone's smiling. You're laughing. And you can't get that at a larger conference. So, though, again, I'm happy larger conferences are back. But I like those events. So, I echo what you said there. Nirosha, talk to me a little bit about, this is a question from our listeners where they want to understand, in your opinion, what's a personality trait that you think one must have to succeed in marketing?

Nirosha Methananda: I did think about this a bit. And for me, it's curiosity. So, innately, when I'm hiring someone, I look for curiosity, because it's not something you can teach. And I think, with marketing, the way things are growing and shifting in terms of the technology, in terms of the role, in terms of knowing and having to understand different personas, being able to have that intellectual curiosity, to go and test things and learn about things, if you don't have that, I think it's going to be very difficult to just plod along and just being in your groove. I think that's part of the excitement of marketing, is being able to change it up, being able to experiment. And I really look for that in what I do and in the team that I hire as well. So, that's what I think, rightly or wrongly so.

Vincent Pietrafesa: Talk to us a little bit about your current marketing strategy and channels, what's working, and what's not working.

Nirosha Methananda: So, as I mentioned, Influ2, from a marketing perspective, we're still fairly immature in some ways. We're still developing, rather. I think what has worked for us and what got Influ2 to where it is five years on is actually using our own tool. And I don't want to just promote our product, but the team really dug in and really built out our campaigns and things like that and the audiences. And being able to outreach from that perspective has really served us well. And what we've coupled that with and where it's really working quite well is with our events, Vincent, I totally agree with you, I really love the smaller events. Don't get me wrong, I love a trade show as well and being able to enjoy that broad experience, but I really liked that direct connection. And for us, especially because what the product does is quite personal, it allows us to couple that personalized advertising, essentially, with that audience that we want to target and really make sure that we have our target audience at these events. And that's something in and of itself that's working. I think also having the smaller events that are more experiential. We host a series of events. And we've hosted a series of events this year. It's called Dine with Influ2. I love to eat. I think inaudible love to eat. It's a good excuse to go and have a nice experience and have a nice dinner and drinks. And there's no agenda for it. So, it's basically just inviting people along to come and sit down, meet some of their peers. I've had some super interesting conversations. I think only one of them has been when someone sat down inaudible, they've been like, " I was just amazed by the way you got me here." And then we went off and talked about Influ2. But other than that, it's just been more of that human connection. And I think that's something, while it's not an immediate" can I sign you up now," it gives them a little bit of a sense. And especially, because we're a new brand, it's building that trust and those relationships that I think has been really important for us. So, those are some of the things that have been working. Content is another one from a content syndication perspective, looking at different reports, and so on and so forth. And I think it's hard. Content is hard. It's just so much time and effort that you have to invest into. For example there's the podcast. There's a lot of planning that goes into it. There's a time. There's effort. There's editing. And so, from our perspective, we really leverage sponsored content, especially not being as well- known in the market, that's been something that's worked for us. And we're more slowly moving into our own content as well. So, those are, I think, probably the core things that have been great for us from a marketing perspective. And hopefully, more to come.

Vincent Pietrafesa: And speaking of what's more to come, anything you can share with us in terms of new products or cool upgrades that are coming up?

Nirosha Methananda: Yes, indeed. We're working on a second product, which is more focused really around automating some of the person- based advertising capability. But what I am really excited about with that product is it really starts to tie in the results. So, back to revenue, back to what sales goals are, and being able to visualize that. So, essentially, it ends up... it's like you're, I want to say, a control center, essentially, for someone who's running these campaigns to be able to understand, cool, here's the campaigns we ran. Here's the audience. Here are the accounts. This is where outreach has been done. Being able to correlate and understand what that engagement has been and then work directly with the sales team at a granular level to be able to really push things through and coordinate campaigns and so on and so forth. So, that's set, too. So, we're going into beta in the next couple of weeks or so. And then, from a launch perspective, we're looking at probably the end of this year, early next year. But I think that's going to be something that's really exciting and the next evolution of Influ2, to some degree.

Vincent Pietrafesa: Now, Nirosha, talk to us about that, because I know Influ2 is using AI now, right? So, can you talk about how you're currently using AI? And then, again, I could keep adding to that some of the future plans there.

Nirosha Methananda: Yeah. So, from an AI perspective, where the AI comes in is really in looking at the results that come from campaigns and then using a predictive... It's essentially a predictive model that looks at a lot of different data points to be able to assess whether that engagement or result how that was connected to an individual, so at a target account. So, for example, looking at yourself. We use that predictive model and the data points around being able to probabilistically identify whether that was you or not, clicking or viewing or whatever it was, and there's a number of different data points. It has to be over 80% in terms of accuracy for us to be able to pass on those results. And that's really where the AI portion comes in. So, what happens is a lot of those interactions from across different campaign, those results, at a person- based level, get aggregated and pushed back. And then there's a scoring model that's attributed to those interactions based on the different engagement. So, part of it is around identifying who that person is, and then being able to assess their engagement into a score that goes back at a person- based level then it's aggregated at a buying group level as well for that account and then at a total account level. So, that's how the AI works. I have to admit, I'm not super technical. SEO is the brains behind it. But from that perspective, that's how it works with the AI. And then in terms of the new product, really, it is about data. So, that's what you said about data is so important in being able to take that data and operationalize it to make it tangible so that you can actually do what you need to do with it and make it meaningful. And that's really what the new product does. So, it's not necessarily AI in the sense of the way that our current product does it. But it is really looking at that data and looking at analysis and being a little bit predictive or advisory around how you can use those insights in checking on the health of campaigns and how you're performing and so on and so forth.

Vincent Pietrafesa: It's very interesting. I remember hearing Dmitri at this particular conference talking about that. And I'd also love to learn a little bit about what makes Influ2 unique from its competitors.

Nirosha Methananda: It is essentially the person- based advertising, being able to take your display and social target the people at your accounts that you want to target and engage with, and understand how they are engaging with you tangibly, at that level, to be able to pass that on to your sales team or pass that into your marketing nurture or other marketing programs. That is the core differentiator of it. That's essentially the fundamentals. I think there are a lot of platforms. And I don't profess to be an expert of every single platform out there. And I know that there are different platforms that do different things and have similarities. But from our customer base, being able to have that granularity, that's something that is a real asset for them and our users.

Ajay Gupta: One of the marquee questions that we to ask is, I'm sure you get a lot of emails and unsolicited LinkedIn messages. What's one that gets your attention? And what's one that you hate?

Nirosha Methananda: One that gets my attention is it's genuine authentic interaction. And when I say that, I see a lot of messages where I'll get an email, then I'll get a phone call, then I'll get a LinkedIn request in the span of, I don't know, an hour. And it's usually not necessarily relevant to me. I appreciate it when someone takes the effort to go to my LinkedIn and see what I've done and customize their email. I may not always respond, but I do look at it. And I think having that genuine interest is great. What I do extra love is when they connect the dots back from my personal interest into their product. And that's gold star. To make it relevant for me, that's what really does get my interest in. And obviously, I think the other thing is harking back to my inaudible, it's about intent. If I'm in market for something or if something's top of mind for me or a pain point, then that's probably going to tweak my interest. And this was one of the things that I'm a great believer in intent, all sorts of intent, and having that, because it not only makes the customer experience better and the prospect experience better. It makes it easier from a sales and a marketing perspective as well, like you're not wasting your time and energy and dollars on people that don't really care, from that perspective. So, hopefully, that answers your question.

Ajay Gupta: Yeah. I had an interesting one come through the other day. Somebody had messaged me about five times in a span of three days after I added them. No idea who this person is. And then the last message did get a reaction from me because it said, " Well, guess you're not responding to me on LinkedIn. But I have your email now through LinkedIn. So, I'll be following up through email and phone calls."

Vincent Pietrafesa: Wow, yeah.

Ajay Gupta: That's a good way to get my reaction.

Vincent Pietrafesa: That's" I'll find you. Some way, I will find you."

Nirosha Methananda: I guess, if you think about the psychology of that, for me, that's borderline stalking.

Ajay Gupta: Yeah, for sure. So, tell us a little bit of... because we like to get on the personal side as well, what do you like to do outside of marketing? What are your hobbies and interests?

Nirosha Methananda: So, one of the things that, actually, I realized during COVID that just feeds my soul is being able to travel. I love to go and explore. And equally, as much as I love going exploring, I love having my beach holidays where I can just chill out and switch off and do that. And during COVID, I really wasn't able to do that. And I realized it makes a big difference. That's when I'm on, I'm on. And when I'm off, I'm definitely off and off the crane. And that helps. Other things I enjoy, I moved to LA from New York. One of the reasons I moved was because of the beach and I wanted to be near the beach. That's something that I super enjoy. That's my happy place to be. And Vincent, this is one for you, I really enjoy stand- up comedy.

Vincent Pietrafesa: Oh, yeah.

Nirosha Methananda: I think going to laugh is like... going out to laugh and enjoy, that's one of the best experiences I can have. I know that you're doing your stand- up comedy.

Vincent Pietrafesa: Yeah, absolutely. I am here in New York City, as you know. And I'm a little mad that you left this great city for LA.

Nirosha Methananda: I know.

Vincent Pietrafesa: And that was going to be my next thought, is how dare you leave New York City? Yeah, there's a lot of comedy clubs here. In LA, too. There's fewer, but they're great. Being able to laugh, people should come to the city and just go to a show. Go to a Broadway show, go to a comedy show. Not even doesn't have to be mine, but yeah.

Nirosha Methananda: Yeah, that's one of my favorite things to do. Every time I go and I see you... I haven't seen your show, I have to admit, since COVID. But I always am like, I want to run and enjoy a new theater.

Vincent Pietrafesa: I love what you said before, itchy feet. I get itchy feet. That's such a great term, or it's like I just want to get out and go. Well, next time you're in New York, it's on the podcast, ladies and gentlemen, so it's real. I will get you free tickets to come see a show with me.

Nirosha Methananda: Oh, I love that.

Vincent Pietrafesa: Stand- up comedy is six to seven comedians. Ajay, he has been. I don't normally talk about it on the podcast, but yeah, now, you could definitely come out.

Nirosha Methananda: I love that.

Vincent Pietrafesa: So, Nirosha, I have just a few more questions before we close here. But this is one that I've never asked before. But I want to understand, what's a commonly held belief about your role in marketing that you passionately disagree with?

Nirosha Methananda: Very passionate about this.

Vincent Pietrafesa: Hence, the laugh beforehand. I love it.

Nirosha Methananda: inaudible. That it's easy. Marketing is easy. All marketers are lazy. I hate, hate, hate hearing that. I think that it's very easy to come in and swan about with different concepts and ideas. But I think being able to really think about how you take that, make it something, execute it, measure it, improve upon it, takes a lot of effort, a lot of attention to detail. And I think that's an unseen part. I've heard over my years, marketers can be lazy, or they're this or that. And it's like, actually, why don't you take a look behind the scenes, of the 50- billion things that they have going on? Certainly, as I said, any given day, I can be editing a copy. I can be doing a podcast. I can be doing a splash page, doing a strategy, whatever it is, especially when it's... actually, I don't care what size the organization is. It's applicable across the board. And I think that's something... I think that's a misconception. And I'm quite passionate about change.

Vincent Pietrafesa: I love hearing that. It's the first time we've asked that question. And it's also, how do you feel about that... I don't know if it's a misconception because you hear it a lot, but how do you feel about how sales and marketing just always butt heads, usually? That's something I disagree with, but I'm wondering how you feel about it.

Nirosha Methananda: I don't think it's a misconception. I think that it exists there. And for me, I think we've been talking about sales and marketing alignment for a long time. And to some degree, yes, there is sales and marketing alignment. And I think the teams are working together. I actually believe that there's a fundamental shift that needs to happen, that sales and marketing teams actually need to be structured and come together, because it's great from the top down creating a strategy and creating SLAs and going through these processes. But actually, when you come to the day- to- day and when you're in the trenches working side- by- side and you have common metrics and goals, for me, I think that's when actually teams come together and you erase some of those silos. And I really strongly think, with the way that things are going in terms of what audience expectations are with technology and so on and so forth, I think that that's probably the future of what's to come in terms of it's my trying to make fetch works marketing, which is sales and marketing alignment. I do think that that's probably the future of where it's going. So, I think different teams have different degrees. Communication is paramount. Communication and human relationships is paramount, particularly, if you're going to try and align. But I think, fundamentally, there just needs to be a shift.

Vincent Pietrafesa: I love that. You've already given us so many amazing thoughts. Just one final closing thought from you about the industry, marketing, life, inspiration, whatever you want.

Nirosha Methananda: So, industry, I'll give it you. Industry, I think there's a lot of noise. There's a lot of chatter. There's a lot of tools. Listen to it. Take it in. Understand it. Consider it. And then think about it in the context of your business and what your team needs. And go from there. Because it can be overwhelming. And I think sometimes you can lose sight of what the business needs are when there's just so much chatter. Life, time, a commodity that we never account for, that is super valuable. So, yeah, value it and appreciate it.

Vincent Pietrafesa: I love it. I love it. Words to live by. Thank you so much, Nirosha, for joining us and spending some time with us here on The Marketing Stir. We really do appreciate it. Ladies and gentlemen, that is Nirosha Methananda, the vice president of marketing at Influ2. Check out Influ2. Check out Nirosha. Ladies and gentlemen, I'm Vincent Pietrafesa. That's Ajay Gupta. This has been another episode of The Marketing Stir. Thank you so much for listening. Thank you so much for approaching me at these trade shows and telling me how much you love the podcast. It means a lot to us. Thank you so much.

Ajay Gupta: Thank you.

Vincent Pietrafesa: Thanks for listening to The Marketing Stir Podcast by Stirista. Please like, rate, and subscribe. If you're interested in being a guest on the podcast, please email us at themarketingstir @ stirista. com. And thanks for listening.